Talk:The Deep Magic

Would someone please explain this to me?
This is one aspect of the Chronicles that I've always struggled to fully understand. While the rules of the Deep Magic sound relatively simple on the surface, and the results of the Deeper Magic clearly speak for themselves, the language of Aslan and Jadis' conversation - as well as Mr. Beaver's quip that Jadis was "the Emperor's hangman" - has always come across as annoyingly cryptic. Admittedly, the ideas behind them are probably grounded in some relatively obscure theological symbolism that I'm simply not aware of, but all I've really seen from analyses is that Jadis is supposed to be a stand-in for Satan (which would almost merit its own discussion).

If anyone can dissect the exact meaning on display here (or as close to exact as the evidence allows), please respond and lay out as much as you can. Gotlvr87 (talk) 03:32, 22 May 2021 (UTC)


 * As I understand it, this is an allegory by C.S. Lewis to explain the reason why (according to his belief system) Jesus (or Aslan in the allegory) has to die, and is resurrected. In traditional Christian Theology, Christ's blood washes away the sins of the rest of humanity, which is said to be part of an innate set of laws set out by God almost as a fundamental part of the universe (i.e. the laws of the Old Testament, called the "Old Covenant", which deals with sin and sacrifice to absolve it). These laws are quite dark, and calling them "The Deep Magic" is his way of explaining them to a younger audience. Jadis is following the rules here too, for her own ends, and demanding a sacrifice as her right, without realising that there is a "Deeper Magic" that transcends that.
 * I'm not sure that Jadis does match Satan perfectly, but there's a parallel here to the start of the Book of Job, where Satan convinces God to keep testing Job with harsher trials, playing within the rules in a way that's detrimental to humanity. She's also the ruler of the world (like Satan being called the "prince of this world" in the New Testament as a way to explain why there is so much suffering - as prince of the world, Satan can be considered to effectively be behind the crucifiction, using Roman authorities to carry this out.)
 * Don't know if that answers your questions? -- xensyria T 10:36, 22 May 2021 (UTC)


 * After I posted my initial query, I went back to my old copy of The Magical Worlds of Narnia by David Colbert. There is a chapter that explains some of these details, and mentions the concept of "Natural Law" as the overarching system that Aslan and Jadis are operating under. Even though I understand the themes a little better now than I did upon my initial readings, I guess my new question relates to Lewis' own mindset in regards to his readers: Is all of this symbolism something he imagined his juvenile audience would fully grasp, or was it built into the narrative as an expression of his own beliefs that wouldn't be terribly important for the average reader to understand? Gotlvr87 (talk) 23:11, 24 May 2021 (UTC)


 * I agree that it doesn't seem like C.S. Lewis was trying to get people to understand it. It's only ever mentioned in passing, and the way that he calls it "magic" shows that he's not providing a reason why is works, just that it does, and also making it feel quite mysterious. I always find myself much more fascinated by these kind of interesting but deliberately obscure parts of the story - it makes it feel like a more complex and complete world that I want to know more about! In terms of writing up a wiki or encylopedia, this does make it quite difficult to cover, as there's so little in the story to document, and the subject is quite difficult to explain to our audience (which I think is people of all ages!) What do you think would be a good way to present this kind of explanation, compared to what's there at the moment? Are there any other good articles here or anywhere else that you've come across that manage to cover this kind of explanation well? (I always feel like there's a better way than calling the section "Trivia" for starters, and there's definitely more to it than just saying that it's basically the Law of Moses!) -- xensyria T 07:58, 25 May 2021 (UTC)


 * I just did a large expansion of the article, citing some of the things we've discussed. Feel free to contribute what you think is missing. Gotlvr87 (talk) 22:49, 27 May 2021 (UTC)


 * Looks good to me! Completely agree about using reliable sources, and I'll try to expand on this and some other articles when I get back into editing here. Thanks for this! :) -- xensyria T 12:30, 30 May 2021 (UTC)